Unbanning Crypto

[Cortez (Mr. T. FOO!)]

There is literally no point to unban someone just to see them get rebanned. That will create a circle of unbanning and rebanning.

Irony and satire does not make rule breaking acceptable. If I were to go and write a racist statement using derogatory term and assumed that people would see the humour and what not I would still be punished because it is still racist, it's still offensive. Assuming Crypto is as smart as he tries to appear he should know that, it's common sense.

Tell me, what good would be gained from an unban? If people can't handle some of the things that Kwaurtz posts as a joke then there is no way in hell that they can handle what Crypto will. Most of the people here that do want him unbanned want it because they are/were his friends which is a very, very bad reason to unban someone. Pillz has been rallying for this for a long time so I honestly believe that he should have no say whatsoever in this. I think that his voice should be worth what it was in the last unban thread, even though he was voted in as a leader, just because he is far to adamant.

My suggestion to the CLs is to look at this objectively. Read the last unban thread, actually listen to what the community members are saying and remember that this is his third permanent ban. I do not believe that anyone else has had that many bans and was given that many chances. Whatever the result of this is, make sure that you have taken the time to seriously consider it.

[Pillz]

There is literally no point to unban someone just to see them get rebanned. That will create a circle of unbanning and rebanning.

Irony and satire does not make rule breaking acceptable. If I were to go and write a racist statement using derogatory term and assumed that people would see the humour and what not I would still be punished because it is still racist, it's still offensive. Assuming Crypto is as smart as he tries to appear he should know that, it's common sense.

Well then the question is now how do we punish Inject for his recent racism thread, I mean yeah he was joking but he had me more convinced that he thinks poor people should stop breeding than Crypto had me convinced he was tired of homosexuality in the news. If it were Rebelmaster or Crypto saying everything Inject said word for word, everyone would have a field day trying to get them banned for it. From what I heard though Inject sounds like he really thought what he's talking about through though, Crypto's post was blatant retardation, just like all the retardation before him in the thread he got banned from.

People keep saying he got chances but I feel like nobody ever really gave him a single one. It was less of a chance and more of a "BE GOOD OR WE'LL FUCKING SLIT YOUR THROAT" kind of thing. Kind of like when an angry parent tells their kid to be good or they'll beat them and the kid naturally gets angry and doesn't want to do anything but be bad.

What good would unbanning him bring? What good does allowing normal players to post do? It allows them to talk with the community and be a part of CG, something Crypto would like to officially be a part of without being labeled the Troll God, and maybe create a good name for himself; but that seems impossible at this point and even if he were unbanned, the way people look at him in CG would probably just have people picking at him until he retaliates, hoping he gets himself banned again.

I'm just saying that the reason for his ban is borderline idiotic and we would NEVER ban somebody from a gameserver for saying things like that. We would warn them and possibly gag them if they continued, but it was an april fools thread that was taken too seriously. If it were an option to reverse the ban due to bullshit, instead of unbanning him; I would go for that but I don't think we do that. As if we have any consistent formality in CG...

Either way my voice should mean nothing more than the rest of the communities, I didn't make this as an attempt to finally get him unbanned now that I'm a CL. Sadly the way the current "RULES" are for this type of thing say that it's the CL'S vote and then HA's vote that matter. I don't agree with how that works either, and think it should be more community dependent. Since Death has chosen not to vote it's up to me and Alpha and I don't think that's very fair because we both know Crypto as a friend where Inject's only ever known him as an enemy, but I guess that means he won't be getting unbanned. I feel like the community is torn on this and don't know what to do.

Pillz +1
Inject -1
Alpha +?

Cortez -1
Christovski +1?
Yahtzee +1
Red +1

Worst Case scenario if we unban him: He calls someone dumb, or as Inject used to say "Do you have down syndrome or something?"
Best Case scenario if we unban him: He posts coherently and gets along with everyone.

He knows the rules, and if he's unbanned; he knows we'll be enforcing them (properly).

[Old Crow]

Yahtzee is a Plus 1

[AlphaWeeaboo]

I was browsing the last thread and Cadaver made some interesting statements in regards to how permanent bans are handled (as of that thread/at the time).

Something along the lines of a 3 areas of banishment. Voice Server, Forums and Gaming servers.

I think if this system is still agreed to be hold uppable and good, he should be unbanned from all EXCEPT the forums. Otherwise if that system sounds bogus/outdated then I will vote yes I guess.

I want to emphasis a tight leash though. I saw many statements that he will behave and if anything happens he will accept a ban, and look where we are now.

[Cortez (Mr. T. FOO!)]

Making jokes about that stuff on a server or in TS/vent is something different all together. I'm not saying that it's okay, but it's easier to understand that it is supposed to be humorous and it's more or less a private conversation. It's not a true comparison. I don't agree with having votes whatsoever. In this instance I think that the CLs should act like members of parlament. You vote on what the people in your riding want, or in this case what you feel the general population of CG wants, unless you have a serious and logical objection to it.

Ps. Yahtzee shouldn't even be considered a HA as he has no real server, but that's something else altogether.

[Pillz]

Making jokes about that stuff on a server or in TS/vent is something different all together. I'm not saying that it's okay, but it's easier to understand that it is supposed to be humorous and it's more or less a private conversation. It's not a true comparison. I don't agree with having votes whatsoever. In this instance I think that the CLs should act like members of parlament. You vote on what the people in your riding want, or in this case what you feel the general population of CG wants, unless you have a serious and logical objection to it.

Ps. Yahtzee shouldn't even be considered a HA as he has no real server, but that's something else altogether.

I honestly don't even know what to do based on the peoples responses in this thread, I feel the negativity against unbanning crypto but I feel like it's almost down the middle here; but I'll count in a little while and we'll give this a few more weeks so Inject doesn't get mad at me.

[Old Crow]

Making jokes about that stuff on a server or in TS/vent is something different all together. I'm not saying that it's okay, but it's easier to understand that it is supposed to be humorous and it's more or less a private conversation. It's not a true comparison. I don't agree with having votes whatsoever. In this instance I think that the CLs should act like members of parlament. You vote on what the people in your riding want, or in this case what you feel the general population of CG wants, unless you have a serious and logical objection to it.

Ps. Yahtzee shouldn't even be considered a HA as he has no real server, but that's something else altogether.

I honestly don't even know what to do based on the peoples responses in this thread, I feel the negativity against unbanning crypto but I feel like it's almost down the middle here; but I'll count in a little while and we'll give this a few more weeks so Inject doesn't get mad at me.

How log is that going to take?

[Christovski]

Look if we can make this work in a way that isn't hypocrisy, like pointing out how bullshit his past bans were because WG banned him for bullshit reasons, and the most recent ban wasn't until a couple days AFTER his post everyone says is responsible for him being banned I'd be +1 to unban.


If we can't come up with a LEGITIMATE reason to unban him, it would just be a big joke to unban him, and in that case I would say -1.

[Pillz]

Look if we can make this work in a way that isn't hypocrisy, like pointing out how bullshit his past bans were because WG banned him for bullshit reasons, and the most recent ban wasn't until a couple days AFTER his post everyone says is responsible for him being banned I'd be +1 to unban.


If we can't come up with a LEGITIMATE reason to unban him, it would just be a big joke to unban him, and in that case I would say -1.

I don't think it would be hypocritical to unban someone who was banned for illegitimate reasons, and I feel Crypto has more ground for getting unbanned based on community input than say RebelMaster or Wholegrain. If we can't get him unbanned from the forums I'd at least like to see him unbanned from ZPS since he's been playing so much lately.

[Ðeath.]

I'd vote for the appeal, for servers; I've played with him on ZPS, he isn't too bad there. Otherwise, don't think my vote's too valid otherwise.

[TowerSheep]

-1
TowerSheep's memory of Crypto:

Minecraft -> Another day playing with my CG bros and in comes Crypot (he whines a lot) and the first thing I hear is him complaining that he can't use some add on in the server. He was kicked for it. He then proceeded to insult Inject for telling him it was against the rules. Next when I asked why he could play without it he just started attacking me. This was the first time I spoke the guy and he was already up my ass for no reason.


I remember not liking him for other reasons but I'm too lazy to think of it. He is a troll and we all know it. Though he's a lot like herpes, once you think he's gone for good there's a random flare up of people who insist he isn't herpes. I don't like the guy and I've never seen him be anything but a dick.

[Inject OH 4]

Well then the question is now how do we punish Inject for his recent racism thread, I mean yeah he was joking but he had me more convinced that he thinks poor people should stop breeding than Crypto had me convinced he was tired of homosexuality in the news. From what I heard though Inject sounds like he really thought what he's talking about through though, Crypto's post was blatant retardation, just like all the retardation before him in the thread he got banned from.

No you're not pulling that shit.
1 I wasn't racist. 2 It was among only friends in a public talking point on TS. Not related and not the same.
Cryptos post where not blatantly obviously or anything. There was no indication he didn't mean them. No more then my own at least. And I'm really damn good at reading between the lines (or more then most people). And if I sound like I was serious or not in that thread is not relevant since I clearly indicated I wasn't, however even if I was that isn't even an issue. You can't ban someone from having a different opinion, wrong or not. The idea is they don't express there opinion not that they don't have it.

For example if someone was a homophobe, we would let them join the community. We wouldn't know, they wouldn't say. And we'd all go along our Marley days. However if he then expressed he opinions and offended a member  or broke the rule within a homophobic way, then yes we punish him. We aren't therapist. We aren't hear to rebuild people.


And my thread was a joke. Really bad timing for Kwaurtz to post it? Yeah. Did I ask him to? No.

we both know Crypto as a friend where Inject's only ever known him as an enemy,

Wrong again. Before ban 3 we got along. I was fine. Then he did something. Cadaver banned him. Fin.

Worst Case scenario if we unban him: He calls someone dumb, or as Inject used to say "Do you have down syndrome or something?"
Best Case scenario if we unban him: He posts coherently and gets along with everyone.

He knows the rules, and if he's unbanned; he knows we'll be enforcing them (properly).

Did he not know the rules the last 3 times he got banned then?
Your logic is tragically flawed.

By this logic we should unban everyone. I don't see how you are able to be so double standard.
And honestly when is the last time I've said "Do you have down syndrome or something?". It's been a pretty long time. Pretty sure I stoped when CG rules changed and we became the Nazi empire we are today.

Oh shit, sorry was that a secret?

[Pillz]

Well then the question is now how do we punish Inject for his recent racism thread, I mean yeah he was joking but he had me more convinced that he thinks poor people should stop breeding than Crypto had me convinced he was tired of homosexuality in the news. From what I heard though Inject sounds like he really thought what he's talking about through though, Crypto's post was blatant retardation, just like all the retardation before him in the thread he got banned from.

No you're not pulling that shit.
1 I wasn't racist. 2 It was among only friends in a public talking point on TS. Not related and not the same.
Cryptos post where not blatantly obviously or anything. There was no indication he didn't mean them. No more then my own at least. And I'm really damn good at reading between the lines (or more then most people). And if I sound like I was serious or not in that thread is not relevant since I clearly indicated I wasn't, however even if I was that isn't even an issue. You can't ban someone from having a different opinion, wrong or not. The idea is they don't express there opinion not that they don't have it.

For example if someone was a homophobe, we would let them join the community. We wouldn't know, they wouldn't say. And we'd all go along our Marley days. However if he then expressed he opinions and offended a member  or broke the rule within a homophobic way, then yes we punish him. We aren't therapist. We aren't hear to rebuild people.


And my thread was a joke. Really bad timing for Kwaurtz to post it? Yeah. Did I ask him to? No.

we both know Crypto as a friend where Inject's only ever known him as an enemy,

Wrong again. Before ban 3 we got along. I was fine. Then he did something. Cadaver banned him. Fin.

Worst Case scenario if we unban him: He calls someone dumb, or as Inject used to say "Do you have down syndrome or something?"
Best Case scenario if we unban him: He posts coherently and gets along with everyone.

He knows the rules, and if he's unbanned; he knows we'll be enforcing them (properly).

Did he not know the rules the last 3 times he got banned then?
Your logic is tragically flawed.

By this logic we should unban everyone. I don't see how you are able to be so double standard.
And honestly when is the last time I've said "Do you have down syndrome or something?". It's been a pretty long time. Pretty sure I stoped when CG rules changed and we became the Nazi empire we are today.

Oh shit, sorry was that a secret?

Hey, if changing us from the Nazi empire we are today makes people happy, I'm down because that's half the problem. That's the point behind me saying "I think the ban was too harsh because the whole thread was a joke, it was an aprils fools day thread", and that's how we knew he wasn't serious. Then he wasn't even being grammatically correct, so that should be a big red flag for someone like Crypto. I agree he's pushed the line before but for example; if I understand the situation correctly he was kicked from MC for complaining about not being able to use an addon~ like I can only imagine how much more that antagonized him, but I don't know what happened so I'll stay out of it.

I'm not seriously saying you've done any wrong Inject, I thought the audio was going to be worse when I saw the thread. The point is both of you were claiming to be joking, and neither of you should be punished. If we're going to follow a system that ends up with people banned for saying pushy things like that repeatedly, we should fairly apply it to everyone and start counting every report to a moderator, giving people 3-30 temporary forum bans and blah blah blah. That'd just be more "nazism" to everyone though I'm sure, but I dunno. Crypto was fine back on the SKG forums, with KAT and never caused any problems until CG. He has always been a fun guy to play ZPS with and talk to, and

I want him unbanned but I'd be willing to vote -1 if the community really doesn't want it. It's REALLY hard to specify the "community" too. No matter WHAT happens, half of CG likes Crypto and wants to give him a chance, the other half doesn't; or at least a portion of the community doesn't get what they want..

Maybe we can organize some community addition to the ban appeal process where everyone can add them and play/talk with Crypto and vote in a month on what they feel should be done.


We need more threads as active as this one btw, 1000+ views already? Jeezypeezy

[Yahtzee]

Making jokes about that stuff on a server or in TS/vent is something different all together. I'm not saying that it's okay, but it's easier to understand that it is supposed to be humorous and it's more or less a private conversation. It's not a true comparison. I don't agree with having votes whatsoever. In this instance I think that the CLs should act like members of parlament. You vote on what the people in your riding want, or in this case what you feel the general population of CG wants, unless you have a serious and logical objection to it.

Ps. Yahtzee shouldn't even be considered a HA as he has no real server, but that's something else altogether.

That stings :c _meinthefeels

[Doc. Mentalist S.]

I've finally finished reading all of your posts.
From what I have read are  that some CG members go from wanting him to remain banned change their opinions to give him a shot and wait for him to tick like a bomb. A few are staying with their -1's. Others are going with +1, because they all know he's a good person who deserves a just appeal.

For those that don't know him or even spend a minute with him, honestly shouldn't have a + or - input. Know him better, get to play or talk to him. I went on skype with him for 3+hours and he's so much different from when he was several months ago. He's a swell guy and always has good discussions/debates to bring to CG.

I know my opinion doesn't count now but, at this point I could have been a CL or HA.
So my verdict would be: Unban him, give him a shot, and instead of treating him like you know he's going to be banned eventually, treat him like a regular person, and give him a warning. CG did implement watch accountability on the forums.