Concerning the Rules

[Christovski]

I dont care about the pre-round QQ, but I agree with the OP, admins should use judgement to determine if someone is delaying or just new/bad, not slay for <2 kills

[forumguy69]

Another suggestion that I have come up with is to have two lists of rules. We keep these rules, and add a new set of simplified rules to actually display in the MOTD. If they wish to look at the current rules ( the in-depth rules) then we should add a link or something of the sort to show them the extended rules. This way we get to keep the current rules, which is pretty lengthy, and replace it with a shorter to the point MOTD that won't scare people away with a big wall of text.

[Blazyd]

First off I think we need to change the "Cancel" button on the MOTD to say "I agree". Sure, 90% of them won't read it but when they click on "I agree" that means they've accepted our rules whether or not they actually read them which means if they break the rules, they're liable for punishment so they can't say they didn't know that something was RDM (because they agreed to our rules). I know we have a very extensive rule list covering nearly every aspect of RDM and gameplay rules. That can be a lot for new people to take in, but it's there for a reason - everyone's well being (including theirs!!)

Another suggestion that I have come up with is to have two lists of rules. We keep these rules, and add a new set of simplified rules to actually display in the MOTD. If they wish to look at the current rules ( the in-depth rules) then we should add a link or something of the sort to show them the extended rules. This way we get to keep the current rules, which is pretty lengthy, and replace it with a shorter to the point MOTD that won't scare people away with a big wall of text.

That big wall of text is necessary because the simplified MOTD won't cover everything. Our strict rules is what makes us one of, if not THE best TTT server around. Why do we need to loosen them up? Looser rules would only make it easier for people to RDM and get away with it, and for trolls to take advantage of this and make everyone's time less enjoyable. It'll also make people not take our RDM punishments as seriously because we don't punish as severely for it.

Also, the "if you run out the time as a traitor with less than 2 kills" rule should stay. 95% of the time the "traitors better trait! if you run out the time with etc etc etc" messages never work because most new people seem to be incapable of reading chat so if they won't read the chat, why would they read the motd? From my experience, new people I slay tend not to break any more rules once I punish them once or twice. Once they see that we'll actually punish them for things, they won't want to be punished anymore and will take reading the rules into higher consideration. Anyway, they waste everyone's 8 minutes so wouldn't it only seems fair to make them sit out a round so their 8 minutes is "wasted" as well?

If they won't listen to us (which most new people don't because they won't read the chat or listen to people talk on the mic), then how else are we gonna deal with them but punish them each time they break a rule?

This confuses new players when they ask why they were slain, and makes them mad and leave.

I don't know about everyone else, but I always tell people the reason that they're being slain before I slay them so it really shouldn't confuse them as to why they were slayed.

[theyankees213]

If we dont want walls of text can we just use the spoiler feature? There are multiple areas to the rules,(Rules, traitorous actions, glitches etc.), so each one gets their own spoiler. Then if you want specific rules highlighted, move them outside the spoiler....

EX: Major rules: 1) No Racist, Homophobic, or derogatory speech.
                        2) No Mic spamming.
                        3)Etc.
      General Rules of Play:

Spoiler for Hidden:

Insert rules that are smaller, like killing pre round.

      Traitorous actions:

Spoiler for Hidden:

Insert these actions.

      Glitching:

Spoiler for Hidden:

See what I mean..

[mjb627]

If we dont want walls of text can we just use the spoiler feature? There are multiple areas to the rules,(Rules, traitorous actions, glitches etc.), so each one gets their own spoiler. Then if you want specific rules highlighted, move them outside the spoiler....

EX: Major rules: 1) No Racist, Homophobic, or derogatory speech.
                        2) No Mic spamming.
                        3)Etc.
      General Rules of Play:

Spoiler for Hidden:

Insert rules that are smaller, like killing pre round.

      Traitorous actions:

Spoiler for Hidden:

Insert these actions.

      Glitching:

Spoiler for Hidden:

See what I mean..

Yes do this ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[HerpDerpMike]

Eh, they most likely won't click the spoilers. :/

[theyankees213]

Eh, they most likely won't click the spoilers. :/

Thats the only problem. People are lazy.

[HerpDerpMike]

We can do what most servers do:

Put a timer on the "I agree" button. So after 10 seconds then they can close it.

[Andredem]

Agree with Blazyd, if someone can actually come up with a rule that they think is too strict we'll do something about it but as far as I'm concerned our rules are in-check.

If an admin does not/forgets to at least give the warning "Traitors better trait, less than 2 kills earns a slay" or something along the lines during the round then they should not be allowed to slay the person and instead warn them at the end of the round. But if they give that warning out during the round then yes, slay. Everyone can read chat.

I also agree with the "Agree to MOTD" button, that's like signing a contract real quick. Works, simple.

There are also some things that bother me that I'll see some admins do:

"DON'T REPORT RDM TILL END OF THE ROUND"

Excuse me? Report the rdm whenever you please after you die, it is our responsibility to keep track of it. We encourage reported rdm, so we shouldn't nitpick it.  though you should report it again at the end of the round, but we're not demanding you not to report it during the game, that's strict/stupid in my opinion

*mutes/gags* after the person says n *****/f **got once.

Give warnings here, most admins do but some admins just gag/mute right away, its dumb. If they are willing to cooperate let them know what they said wrong. I know they are responsible for reading the rules they clarify to prohibit that speech, but still, warnings don't make us seem to gag/mute-happy

[crovv]

"DON'T REPORT RDM TILL END OF THE ROUND"

I personally only say this when a) I'm alive or b) another admin is alive during the round. The reason I started is because a fellow admin (I can't remember who it was) gave me the reasoning that it is basically ghosting -- that is, the admins can see who killed who in admin chat and decide whether or not it was RDM, and therefore kill - or not kill - the person during the round. I don't give the warning if I'm dead/spectator and no other admins are on, etc, but I've continued this philosophy because I think admins shouldn't have an unfair advantage over players, and admin chat gives an advantage - knowing who is dead before they are IDed, knowing who killed them, and knowing/guessing whether or not it was RDM.

As for the mute/gag, I don't have much of a tolerance for someone who uses that kind of language. I warn at least once before muting/gagging, but not always more than once. The same with blatant micspam. If you're being ignorant/annoying enough to do that what seems like on purpose, why should I have to give you 2-3 warnings if you won't stop?

[Andredem]

"DON'T REPORT RDM TILL END OF THE ROUND"

I personally only say this when a) I'm alive or b) another admin is alive during the round. The reason I started is because a fellow admin (I can't remember who it was) gave me the reasoning that it is basically ghosting -- that is, the admins can see who killed who in admin chat and decide whether or not it was RDM, and therefore kill - or not kill - the person during the round. I don't give the warning if I'm dead/spectator and no other admins are on, etc, but I've continued this philosophy because I think admins shouldn't have an unfair advantage over players, and admin chat gives an advantage - knowing who is dead before they are IDed, knowing who killed them, and knowing/guessing whether or not it was RDM.

As for the mute/gag, I don't have much of a tolerance for someone who uses that kind of language. I warn at least once before muting/gagging, but not always more than once. The same with blatant micspam. If you're being ignorant/annoying enough to do that what seems like on purpose, why should I have to give you 2-3 warnings if you won't stop?

I didn't think about ghosting, that's a good point. But how does that give you an advantage if it's an innocent rdming another, which is most the time what happens? I mean some odd cases will be a T buddy rdming another T buddy.. which maybe they should be required to wait in that scenario but still, I don't know. I can kind of see maybe where an admin will know someone is proven without a non-admin possibly knowing that particular person is proven and use that in the "last traitor" situations and whatever but I think we are held more responsible than that

And yeah, for the gag I'm just saying give 1 warning, only 1. If they are a regular don't even worry about it.

[theyankees213]

"DON'T REPORT RDM TILL END OF THE ROUND"

I personally only say this when a) I'm alive or b) another admin is alive during the round. The reason I started is because a fellow admin (I can't remember who it was) gave me the reasoning that it is basically ghosting -- that is, the admins can see who killed who in admin chat and decide whether or not it was RDM, and therefore kill - or not kill - the person during the round. I don't give the warning if I'm dead/spectator and no other admins are on, etc, but I've continued this philosophy because I think admins shouldn't have an unfair advantage over players, and admin chat gives an advantage - knowing who is dead before they are IDed, knowing who killed them, and knowing/guessing whether or not it was RDM.

As for the mute/gag, I don't have much of a tolerance for someone who uses that kind of language. I warn at least once before muting/gagging, but not always more than once. The same with blatant micspam. If you're being ignorant/annoying enough to do that what seems like on purpose, why should I have to give you 2-3 warnings if you won't stop?

If someone says "I was rdmed" I tend not to care, I know I will deal with it at the end of the round. If someone says " Traitor A rdmed Traitor B" or something that gives away people, I get angry because that is almost ghosting, but normally there a newer player so they dont understand whats wrong with it so I just warn them and let it go.

[Tyber]

TL;DR second page.

I think the pre-round slays are a little extreme, if they keep on doing it, maybe you should just say something to them instead of slaying them instantly. And if the player is new, maybe we shouldn't be so strict. Like maybe a warning/slap if it's there 1st-2nd RDM, depending on the admins judgement (As in, if they obviously just RDM'd someone and there's no excuse, sure slay them. But if its something like blocking a doorway or following someone, maybe give em some slack. The rules are pretty long, and they might be so used to things working differently in different servers that they think it's fine to follow or forget the rule).

Personally, I think the rules should just be a solid ground for the admin to know what right and what's wrong. But, if they feel like it's unfair to go as hard on a BRAND new player as you would on a regular, they should be able to SLIGHTLY change or bend PUNISHMENTS for the rules. Is he brand new? Does he seem like someone who generally wants to play the game? Maybe go a little easy on him, slap him instead slay for some of our more complicated situation based RDM rules and such, same for the <2 kills thing. If they're just bad players and maybe wanna be strategic about their approach, then why should they be punished?

In all, I think giving admins more power instead of just being able to enforce the rules that are set in stone, will benefit the server. Will it be harder to find good admins? Definitely. But it will allow those admins that have good judgement (Nexus for one, I'm not sure how many of my previous admin buddys have resigned) to really shine and make the server a much better place.

<3 a very ranty Tyber

[theyankees213]

TL;DR second page.

I think the pre-round slays are a little extreme, if they keep on doing it, maybe you should just say something to them instead of slaying them instantly. And if the player is new, maybe we shouldn't be so strict. Like maybe a warning/slap if it's there 1st-2nd RDM, depending on the admins judgement (As in, if they obviously just RDM'd someone and there's no excuse, sure slay them. But if its something like blocking a doorway or following someone, maybe give em some slack. The rules are pretty long, and they might be so used to things working differently in different servers that they think it's fine to follow or forget the rule).

Personally, I think the rules should just be a solid ground for the admin to know what right and what's wrong. But, if they feel like it's unfair to go as hard on a BRAND new player as you would on a regular, they should be able to SLIGHTLY change or bend PUNISHMENTS for the rules. Is he brand new? Does he seem like someone who generally wants to play the game? Maybe go a little easy on him, slap him instead slay for some of our more complicated situation based RDM rules and such, same for the <2 kills thing. If they're just bad players and maybe wanna be strategic about their approach, then why should they be punished?

In all, I think giving admins more power instead of just being able to enforce the rules that are set in stone, will benefit the server. Will it be harder to find good admins? Definitely. But it will allow those admins that have good judgement (Nexus for one, I'm not sure how many of my previous admin buddys have resigned) to really shine and make the server a much better place.

<3 a very ranty Tyber

I HAVE BAD JUDGEMENT??
Anyways, I agree. If you leave it up to the admins to determine more things and allow them to forgive first time offenders, it would be a happier enviroment IMO.

[(QC) Spell Bound]

People come and play on our servers exactly because we have strict rules, I mean simplifying or removing some of them will just bring in the trolls and rdmers. TTT fans want to play serious rounds, have fun and enjoy a troll free server.

I have seen all kinds of players on this server, even admins that used to bend rules on their own back in the days.
We have to maintain this strict set of rules, making them simple suggests we strip them down or remove the bureaucratic grammar or woot?

If you really want to remove any rules, I only agree with what forum guy said about removing the rule of 2 kills or less= slay in t rounds.

For any other rule, the admin has to enforce them like his bible, because I disagree with warnings since they only bring in more trolls who will take advantage of this.

For pre-round slays: that's too damn over-exagerated, I mean this is a ritual in TTT before any round starts, the point of the game isn't only to kill ts, it's to salvage guns, survive, if you get killed by someone in pre round, then you didn't do a good enough job trying to protect your findings.

Edit: it's all about the admin's judgement, I mean we're not robo cops or anything, we're HUMANs, we forgive or we enforce, we use our best judgement when we punish. Punishment can take a positive effect or a negative effect,  we should avoid it if we have to when we judge the situation to be in less need of it. I mean this is psychology 101, negative punishment, reinforcements and shit, what am I saying, but you get the point.